Zimmerman- Self Defense or Murder ?
 

Anyone following this trial ?

cant help but follow it....it's all the news and talk shows are talking about.....I say self defense.....martin put his life at risk when he decided to attack zimmerman.

I've been following it, what i have to say will probably be unpopular here on the forum, but it's just my opinion, if i had the money i would buy a few billbords in Sandford Fl. calling for Zimmerion to be Gov. of Fl. and donate to his defense. This whole trial is because of NAACP, and their tax free statis, they are so political that in my opinion they should not have a tax free statis.
In my neighborhood if someone was walking around in a HOODY after dark in 70* weather, he would have been accosted by atleast 5 neighbors including myself, and if that person was agressive and attacked anyone of my neighbors or me he would have been dead in less than a heartbeat.
I do have to mention that i live in a small town and everyone is respectful and protective of one another, we have almost no crime rate in my town, and a person can leave their 4 wheeler or anything else in their front yard and it doesn't get touched.

BJ i have to mention when i lived in Anderson the crime rate was already becomming bad and in Greenville it was really bad. While i lived in Anderson i went to the 1968 Gator nationals with a car and while i was gone someone broke into my shop and stold all my tools and 2 sets of heads and everything tht wasn't nailed down, except my machinest tool box, i guess they had never see a set of micrometers so they left them. About 5 mo's later i sold my house and moved back to a Chgo. surburb which had less crime.

O"K i had my speal, i hate a thief and i never want to shoot anyone but if i had too i wouldn't hasitate.

JMO JMO JMO

Zip.

I agree self defense Zip. They cannot convict him if there is a shred of reasonable doubt. No question from what I saw so far plenty of reasonable doubt raised .

Your right about the crime here in Greenville,Anderson, Spartanburg area real bad..

Yeah Zip I feel a little like you on some things on here and being unpopular. I have to

Keep reminding myself I come from a very conservative state when it comes to guns and personal defense. Many other states do not embrace our culture we have in SC when it comes to that stuff.

I agree Bjuice, reasonable doubt is going to get him off. The prosecutions star witness, Rachel Jeantel, was about as cocky as any witness could be on the stand.
After seeing some of the testimony and evidence so far I dont doubt that Zimmerman may have pushed his boundries following the kid but his self defense story is going to stick and unless something incriminating pops up he will be found not guilty. My warning is to anyone that lives in that area keep your doors locked and guns close by cause when the juries decision comes down it gonna be riot and looting time! :evil:

i havent been following the whole thing... but wasnt he sneaking around in a "gated" community of which he didnt even live? the way i see it... if OJ got found not guilty then george has nothing to worry about

The whole thing stunk from the beginning.
First a picture of a 12 year old boy.
Then "Trayvon could be my child".
Then Jessie and Al.........

black guy kills white guy. nobody says or does anything. white guy kills a black guy every black in America yells racism..makes me not only mad but even more racist than I already am...

I understand what your saying Ken. They are making side shows out of this case with thibgs like why did he own a gun.. Well because its his right.

The air marshall Zimmermans friend testified he feels all non felons should own and carry a firearm.

This may sound strange to some coming from a former law enforcement officer. I feel that NON VIOLENT VICTIMLESS CRIMES ( Which accounts for most drug offenses excluding trafficking) that ends up being a felony should be reviewed in 10 yrs or so and if that person is reformed and walking the line he/she should automatically get their civil rights back including right to own and carry firearm.

I mean a 19 year old caught with a OZ of reefer is a now convicted felon and so is the dude who went in a movie theater and killed 20 people...both convicted felons bur can you honestly say its the same ????

Have you heard about the Midwest City,. Oklahoma hostage situation?
(Large) man takes 2 year old from shopping cart and holds knife pointed at her side. Mother in a panic, negotiations failed, etc.

"Police said Wallace then started a 60-second countdown that the suspect warned would end up with him harming the child.
That’s when police Capt. David Huff walked up to Wallace and shot him point-blank in the head."

If there was nobody with a carry permit in the store, at least the Police Capt. solved the problem.

I say self defense based on what I have heard so far.I know any time a self defence shooting happens that it has to be investageted and justified. When justifiedthat should be the end of it no court and lawyer fees and no million $$$$ lawsuit. This poor guy will be hounded the rest of his life lord knows what his legal bill will add up to.

Bjuice, I agree about non violent felons getting a second chance at a clean slateafter a period of time. My dad and I were talking about that last weekend in fact.

This case is not really about self defense or murder. I have been following it. I believe Zimmerman to be innocent & that he was clearly in danger & thought he needed defend himself. He didn't want to kill that kid. This case is about Black VS White... period. BTW: Zimmerman looks Hispanic???? "Stand your ground" engagement been meant. Very questionable jury selection too!!! This is about an old race problem we have had for too long.... some Black people just feel they are still victims in this day & age still. I wish we could move on & just get along.

I thought the "knock knock" joke opening line was a poor choice for the defense... bad taste & timing... I mean a kid died... not a good idea to crack jokes when defending your client.

Guilty or innocent isn't for me to say, however if they DON'T convict him get ready for Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson.....just my opinion.


I agree with BJUICE on the felon thing. Although my crime could have very easily turned out very bad...thank God I never hurt or killed anyone. So maybe not the same as a drug offense.I have stated on this forum before that I am a recovering alcoholic....and a felon. I got two DUI in a three year period in the late 90's....I learned my lesson and my last drink was January 20, 2000. My sobriety date is 1-21-2000. I can never own a firearm, ever. I showed piss poor judgement in my 20's so I guess I made my bed so I will lie in it.

sorry to get off topic.

That's not off topic Tod, that's exactly what Bjuice is talking about. I have a buddy in the same boat as you. about 15 years ago he had a tough time after his wife left him, got a bunch of DUI's in a short time and got a felony charge. Had to plead guilty or take the chance of doing time if he took the case to court. He was an avid hunter, had to get rid of all his hunting stuff and that felony is now a permanent mark. :evil:

It's not just about guns like Harbone and Tod 74 said its a mark that will always follow you lots of company's won't hire a person with a felony no matter how many years ago it was.lots of good people have made mistakes when the were younger mostly from partying there should be some consideration taken.

I was actually granted Alternative Misdemeanor Sentencing which means once I completed all my probation and time served etc I could petition court to change it from a D felony to an A misdemeanor. The judge told me when she sentenced me that if I did what I was supposed to do, that she would grant the request. I was never told there was a time limit....I waited a few years due to no money for lawyer only to find out it was too late.

The good thing you have going is that its a State Charge. Meaning the State govener could pardon you or could even expunge. There is no charge for sending up your application request. I will not lie if you had an Attorney that was connected to the governer or if you new someone that could speak and hand deliver on your account this could get done pretty darn quick for you.

Count your blessings it wasn't a Federal Charge...[/b]

murder, but he will get off.

well this ishow I see it.a black kid lookin like a punk or thug fi you will. wearin a hoodie baggy jeans. profiling if you want but that's how all the thugs dress.walkin down the road. white guy sees him and they have words. black kid gets his ass up in the air with his smart mouth. thinks hes a bad ass and goes after white guy. white guy suprises black kid with gun and bang black kid dead. I hate it for his parents.i really do.but he had it coming. if he had been here and it was me he came after. id have filled his ass plum full of lead.i wont be intimidated or threatened ever.its been tried and it didn't turn out pretty.im not a badass.but I am a man who lives and lets live so leave me alone or you will pay.thats how ive always been and will always be.my life and my families lives come before anything. I will kill you then worry about the law later. better to deal with the law than try to come back from the dead.if they cut this guy loose there will be riots in the streets. blacks gotta keep this crap alive.well let them riot. they always seem to burn their own places down anyway.and if they do start tearing up white people places and hurting them kill some more. im sorry guys but im tired of all this crap.

I say Self Defense :!: :!:

Tod: Here in Oregon, I got felony in 1988 & was charged w Assault 2 (bad day drinking w/ a wild friend) we got into a fight. Went jail, probation, fines, etc.... 9 yrs later it was reduced to a misdemeanor. Current laws here say that I can own/posses a gun if: I did not use one when I committed the felony, I could only have one felony offense, & 15 years had to pass after completion of probation. I fit those guidelines... but it also says to purchase a brand new gun, I must have it expunged first. Basically, I can posses & own but not purchase new until have my lawyer do formally.

Thats interesting you mention that about State Law....this topic came up at work with a friend of mine....I have been told that some state laws allow it after certain amount of time etc, but FEDERAL LAW prohibits any convicted felon from owning or possessing firearms or amunition... So you could still be charged under federal law....idk I actually do not WANT a gun. However I hate the idea that I could possibly be sent to prison if a buddy has one in my truck or whatever.I have thought about hiring a lawyer to sit down with me and go over my options, if there are any.

It would be in your best interest to consult with a lawyer..Scoot cover yourself too. The FEDS are stupid serious when making gun charges.. ( 10 yrs a pop ) .

This just happened locally..listen to this. local man comes home after midnight and sees two mask men breaking in his home. He grabs his girlfriends handgun approaches the two mask men and ends up shooting and killing them after a confrontation.
The local sheriff clears the man of any wrong doing because of SC castle law stand your ground...

The feds came in a month later and charged him Felon in posession of firearm..he pled to 6 yrs last month meaning he will serve 48 months.

He had a check charge back from 10 years ago that somehow became a Felony.

Now let me ask you does this sound like they took a criminal off the streets to protect the community or was the FEDS padding their convictions ?

I am a Lifelong registered republican,a Former law enforcement officer (Selective Enforcement ) city and State level..I am a lifelong NRA member...with this said I know the system is BROKE with this Felon thing...many think the type of crime determines if its a Felony or not while this may be somewhat true how its really determined is if the crime is punishable by more than 1 year in prison even if probation is handed down.
Because of my past experience I am very passionate when I say the Felony needs to be broken down as Violent and/or victimless..

There are MANY great people out here that are pillers of our community that may have one of those Felonies I speak of...much like Scoot and Tod...there is another sub culture of these people out here. We do not hear much about it because these people want it to remain in their past for fear of repercussion of society (jobs) etc....

Tod and Scoot I stand and Salute you BOTH for speaking about this. America has it wrong here and we need to fix it.

Sorry so long of post but somethings I feel strongly about. It bothers me when red tape infringes on Americans 2nd Amendment right.

Don't get me started on incarceration..America locks up more of its people than any country in the world ! WHY ??? MONEY !!!! Let me say one word and you do the google thing UNICOR.

OK I will shut up now....

:evil:

This crazy day and time where the home invasions are all too common. I would hate to think my only option to protect my family came down to hand to hand..

What I would recommend to anyone that cannot own a firearm legally is the 209 magnum front break muzzle loader. This thing shoots a 50 cal. Round 2100 ft per second with enough energy to drop a mature bull moose in its tracks 100 yards away.

This loader uses Dry pellets as the ignitor. altough not recommended in operation instructions you CAN load the pellets and if the weapon is needed just insert the primer and your hot. The primer is nothing more than a shotgun primer.
Even thou we are speaking about self defense with this weapon I WOULD NOT keep the gun around house with pellets and primer. It takes 3 seconds to load primer

You don't have but one shot but thats all you will need.

These are not considered firearms or ammo and legal for anyone to buy or own

There are also some high powered multi shot pellet guns out there, and the old standby 'Canine Early Warning System' ! :D :D :D

well I have a different take on this. law or no law about felons. if I feel the need for a gun in my house ill have one.the founding fathers said its my right,so be it.a kid gets popped for drugs and 40 yrs later he cant protect his family.thin k not boys. a dui felony can stop you. that's stupid...I can see violent felons not being able to own oner but not simple drug possessions and dui .lot of laws out there now days.easy to become a felon and not really try....

Outlaw I AGREE 110%.

Not to jump subject but have you saw the reality show on the 1% MTC Club Warlocks ?.
Wow !. Question Ken. I do not know much about the MTC club life trom within but I could not imagine any 81 club members making a open reality show like that or Outlaws for that matter.... Also I saw on news where Warlocks from another state shot up Warlocks from Florida ? Are they not the same club ?

I watched that as well. The guy gets out of the big house and immediately violates probation in several ways.
Then moving the remains of a members wife to a closer cemetery, they all arm up locked and loaded???

now if I tell you all how things are suppose to be ,then what does that make me.i will tell yall this.i don't watch those shows. most of it is bs.if this guy goes on tv and starts talkin,one of 2 things are happening.one,every word he says is scripted.and approved by the warlocks.the national prez usually approves of every word he is gonna say.or his chapter prez must do it.2, hes runnin his mouth without approval and he will become a missing person.almost every club ive been involved with in oneway or another is a closed society.we,they do not tell anyone their business.even brothers all wearing the same patch don't know what the hells going on in their club unless the prez wants it known.now for this tv thing,i cant tell ya whats up because like I said before I don't watch them.but I can tell you its not much different that honey boob boo.because a lot of it is made for tv,maybe not all but a lot.we may live on the edge of society but we are not stupid.why would any brother let the cat out of the bag. its for tv dude...I will say that a lot of the young guns comin up now don't know or believe like we did.we make no deals with the law.no matter what kinda time we may be lookin at.we stood our ground so to speak. we did the crime now we will do the time.not todays people.some,not all talk to get a lighter sentence and I hate that kind a guy.if they are saying things on the show that makes you think about them letting the cat out you can bet your bottom dollar they have been thru every word that was said before it was said.now for the shootout.i haven't heard anything but if it is warlock against warlock its internal fight.and if it goes on very long it will get bloody.warlocks are a group of brothers who believe shoot first.then find out the answers.not good when you need to be under the radar..now as far as going armed.well yes .a lot of guys who wear a patch carry a gun. they have to.they must protect not only themselves but the brothers as well.and the warlocks are or were at war with a couple of well known clubs.so it is not to smart to not be carrying a gun. screw permits.alot of them boys are vets. those are the ones who think they paid for their permit.and I agree with them on that!!!!!! just wearing a warlock patch can get you killed in some places.clubs have territories they protect.and they will protect them with bullets and knives.anyone who wears a patch knows where he can fly his own colors and where not to fly them.these guys are insanely loyal to each other and anyone else they like.when they say I got your back they mean it. its not just words to us its part of our manhood.we are loyal to a fault. most are very conservative in their politics.they are more patriotic than most americans.very protective of anyone or anything they love.id rather have 2 brothers watchin my back than a whole army of street punks.these guys don't believe in getting a citizeninvolved in their problems so they don't go around killin innocent people.if a brothwer comes at you you can bet your ass you did something you were not suppose to do....now ive gone and said just about more than I should but I really haven't said anything.see how it works. talk all day and never say a word....lol

thanks Outlaw..That makes sense...very interesting stuff !

don't worry dd, they will be..they love this country.even more than a regular citizen.and they show it.they love kids...and they show it.they love their wives and they show it.back in the nam days sonny barger formthe hells angels told noxon he would take his club to nam and they would finish the war.of course they didn't look likecitizens or live like them and Nixon said no way.think about it. most were already vets and knew how to fight.i believe with all my heart that if Nixon had done just what sonny wanted they would have brought it to a end a lot earlier..h.a. fightin guerilla style in nam with all the supplies they needed. hell yeah they would have won.

The Judge...
 

If she mentions a "van down by the river" at any time during the trial I am gonna piss myself :!: :lol:


http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w...pse4fd2ea9.jpg

Damn!! thats eerie :shock:

she even has a stach!!!

Holy Crap !!! Funny as Hell bone. I showed a buddy and we laughed until our stomachs hurt !!!!! LMAO.

Man I tell ya since I made this post this case has went Bad to Worse...The racist side has surfaced BIG time. I gotta stand beside Outlaw on this one.

Let me say how MUCH I despise prosecution . Yes I despise them !!!!!.they seek convictions over the truth...I was a police officer in mid 80's and State Trooper early 90's. so I know 1st hand what snakes they are...Just like Outlaw said about old school bikers being solid.. New school NOT so much...Same in Cop world I suited up and worked with some Solid men..this time period on my platoon I was working with 8 vietnam vets one of them was my field training officer 5 out of the 8 are now deceased from cystic fibrosis..we all know it was agent orange.. My FTO was a hell of a man "Master Patrolman" Gene Lee . He was always cool and calm..on 3rd one night we came under fire from some crack heads between some old mill houses. Gene was composed and in control as the rounds of a 30.06 was richocheting above our heads.. I was 21 yrs old and scared as hell..un-mistakable sound of this round buzzing a few feet above your head.. While Gene held the line and kept the a$$hole pinned down he kept reassuring me he would not let me get hurt...after this ended I saw Gene over in the Dark behind a patrol car shaking and trembling and sweating. The other veteran officers told me to leave him alone..come to find out Gene had taken a AK47 round thru his shoulder while on patrol in Nam..basically his unit and Charlie walked up on each other at a clearing Genes marine unit dropped to the prone position and starting firing. Gene reached back for Ammo box and took the round in shoulder blades . He woke up in Germany. He had a hole in between his shoulder blades big enough to put your fist in...Gene did not tell me the story his wife did..after a few years of getting to know him off duty he did open up to me. Gene was 6 ft 1 250 lbs rock hard..he was a man phyiscally as well as mentally.. When he died his wife would pick him up and change his diaper. He loved his country his wife and family..He was and still is my Hero..There are Very few Gene Lee's out here today...As time went on it law enforcement got weaker and weaker and the main reason I hung it up..not many good solid men left in that field.. As a whole I do not trust COPs as a whole unit.. After working in the trenches with the Gene Lee's ..it just ain' t the same trying to lay it down with a liberal college grad that will write a supplemental on their fellow officer/soldier..unless you been in this line of work just trust me in what I say.. I know this is long but I had it on my heart to tell you about Gene.

MORAL OF STORY : Vets... ( Vietnam Vets ) in particular are a different breed. A solid Group ..No matter if they are in a 1% Mtc club or some type of former civil service.. They are a dying breed that can never be replaced Its been an honor to serve beside these guys !!

dd, you hit it right there with the last few words....I truly do not recognize my country anymore.this is not the country I grew up with.that I loved with all my heart.that I felt safe anywhere I went.im almost ashamed of what they have done to her.ive never believed that revolutions were the answer. but my mind has changed. it will take one to get my country back but then we will have to have people to run it. not the same bunch we had or ones like them. it rather have a congress made up of hardcore scooter tramps and vets than anyone else.in fact my dad said once that to be in public office in d.c you should have had to serve in the armed forces.. not a bad idea...

I have watched the outlaw biker shows. There is one on the Warlocks and also the HA and a couple of other clubs. I don't know why but that stuff really interests me. I have no comment on the activities of these clubs( alleged) but you have to admire their loyalty to each other.

I ride a Honda VTX and I have seen guys on a forum for VTX that buy patches and vests and want to ride around like they are an MC or something. a couple of them were approached by members of an MC and asked to remove the vests, because they had a State name on the rocker. Apparently the Members that asked them to remove them were not aggressive or threatening, they just asked them to take em off so they did. That made me curious so I did some reading and learned a little about the 3 pc patch and rockers claiming territory etc. Pretty interesting, I had no clue.